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> VP 3021: 80% strength, 98% quality but choppy signal?, Was perfect before new digital antenna & windows7?
j_frost
post Feb 10 2010, 12:06 PM
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Hi guys,

I am not sure what happened to my old account, but here goes my first post with my new one : P

On every channel via either scan channels bda or the signal statistics option in DW2.0.7.6, the card apparently is receiving 80% signal strength on most channels, and the quality of the signal is indicated to be around 98%.

I am using win7 enterprise edition and media centre live tv is terrible. Digital watch is better but still stuttery\pixaly. Funny thing is it almost starts off perfect picture then after 10-15 secs progressively gets worse until MC loses the signal altogether. DW seems to continue to run but it appears there is something amiss with my tv reception?

I guess I first noticed this after I replaced the antenna (a receiver broke on the old one so I installed a recommended matchmaster digital antenna (MD17). It currently has 3 outlets connected via a 6 way splitter with the unconnected outlets capped.

The problem still existed so I then figured the problem must be my old cable. I put rg6 quadshield through the house, and still very little improvement.

I then switched from Spectrums BDA drivers to twinhan BDADriverV1.2.3.8_WHQL, still no difference. I have exhausted my limited knowledge, and I guess am asking if anyone else might be able to provide some insight or advice on what to try next.

I thought if I had the above signal statistics that my signal should be ok, could it be windows7 somehow? I have spent enough cash on antennas and cabling, I only want to buy a mast head amp if it will help me. You think that would help?

I have attached a couple of scanchannelsBDA logs to the post so you can see the strengh\quality etc.

Thanks again

Julian
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Attached File  scan_channel_logs.zip ( 2.98K ) Number of downloads: 5
 
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anton
post Feb 10 2010, 10:37 PM
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Hi Julian,

im not sure if this will help, but at least its info for you.

This is what i have found under w7.

Did you say you changed to w7? if you have, then chances are the codecs are different from vista or xp.

w7 without any codec installs runs the microsoft dvd-dvt mpeg2 decoder combined with the vmr9 (AFAIK) renderer for live and recorded tv under wmc. Normally this gives very good picture quality (including deinterlacing ).

if you have installed some codec packs, then perhaps they are overriding the default dvd-dvt mpeg2 decoder and are no longer deinterlacing the image.

for instance ffdshow doesnt default on with deinterlacing and even with it on, it doesnt match the w7 default. (under vista, ffdshow is better ).

if you have purevideo codecs, then they "should" work well, but make sure that the wmc settings are on.

if you have cyberlink mpeg2 codecs, then by default again deinterlacing does not go on by default, and i am not aware of any way to get them going through wmc.


one other thing i have found is if you are running ORB. orb installs its own mpeg2 codec, and even though i havent looked at it deeply, it again doesnt seem to deinterlace and sets itself up as the main codec to use.



the scanchannel logs you gave show what should be excellent reception. Is it from perth?



when you find what the problem is, please post back as this is an interesting problem.


Cheers
Anton


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Smovie TV
Pure entertainment.

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j_frost
post Feb 11 2010, 05:50 PM
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Hi Mate,

Thanks for the reply Anton and you are spot on, I am in Perth

I was advised to buy a masthead amp by the retailer I purchased the antenna through. They said because I had 3 outlets connected to the antenna it was going to be borderline with reception for the MD17. I fitted it last night and it boosted the signal strength by about 6-8% at half attenuation, but the issue is still the same : (

Digitalwatch performs much better using Nvidia purevideo decoder, but still has the odd glitch in particular is seems with GO.

MC I found out was using the standard codec so I used a utility to change it to purevideo decoder. By default it selects "overlay" mode, but everytime I set its properties to VMR9, when MC starts back up it has returned to "overlay". It wont make the chages without exiting the running application.

Exuse my ignorance but could you please explain what you mean by the following:
(in particular the part about the wmc settings)

QUOTE
if you have purevideo codecs, then they "should" work well, but make sure that the wmc settings are on.


Thanks again, and hopefully I can return with some good news.

Julian
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anton
post Feb 11 2010, 10:59 PM
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Hi Julian,

QUOTE
if you have purevideo codecs, then they "should" work well, but make sure that the wmc settings are on.


under windows startmenu, all programs, accessories, media center, media center programs, nvidia settings, this launches a config for purevideo for wmc.

i have run it before and it seemed to work.


how did you find out that MC was using the standard codec btw?

If it is using the "microsoft dtv-dvd video decoder", which afaik is the default, then it should be really good under w7.

this all of course is assuming that its the deinterlacing that is the problem.


if you know your way around graphedit, grab a graph of one of your recorded shows and it will display what codecs are used.

or if you are new to graphedit and can be bothered going to the effort, google to download graphedit. then pick "streambuffersource" under the directshow filters, pick your wtv or dvr-ms file and then right click on each of the "pins" sticking out of the streambuffersource filter and select render pin.)
then take a screenshot of the filters that are used and post it here.


cheers
Anton


--------------------
Smovie TV
Pure entertainment.

www.smovie.tv
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j_frost
post Feb 16 2010, 11:18 AM
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Hi Anton,

Sorry about the delay, I finally got onto graphedit and did as you suggested. It appears that the video decoder is the default microsoft one. I am not sure if it is signifigant or not, but the TV seems perfect for about the first 15 seconds and then starts pixellating.

Please find attached an example of the playback, and also the graphedit image. With the playback example, it becomes pixellated like that every 15 seconds or so, then plays back perfect picture again.

I hope I can get this figured out, I'm a bit lost with it at the moment.

I also installed a masthead amp, I guess I expected to see a boost in signal strength, no difference seen with scanchannels. Even with the gain wound up to 24dB. Still 80% strength, 98% quality.

Thanks again

Frosty
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Attached File  Frost_tv.zip ( 126.16K ) Number of downloads: 7
 
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j_frost
post Feb 17 2010, 12:46 AM
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Hey Guys,

I discovered something strange last night. I can't explain whats going on here, I hope someone else can shed some light.

I was running ScanChannelsBDA_UK watching my signal (without actually streaming media). It ran perfectly for minutes without a glitch, min and max quality where 98%, strength min and max 86% +\- 1%. I then opened up a movie in windows media player, and 15-20 seconds later the signal starts to drop out. after about 45 seconds signal stops completly until I lock onto another channel then the cycle starts again.

So it seems somehow media streaming is somehow effecting my digital signal?

Is this possible? I don't understand.

Any ideas?

Thanks

Julian.
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anton
post Feb 17 2010, 08:55 AM
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Hi Julian,

from the graph screenshot, it looks like everything is perfect there, so its not your codecs.
and from you having near perfect reception (at least at the start) i would hazard to say its not the aerial or cabling.


it's starting to sound like a hardware problem. this is just a hunch though.

perhaps something is overheating. either the tuner card/usb or a booster or an attenuator (if you have one)

or if i take a shot in the dark, you have your video card close to your tuner card and the video card is getting very hot and overheating the tuner.

the only other thing that it might be is interference from something electrical. there are "filters" that you can buy/attach to the tv aerial to clean up the signal, but i am not sure its the problem here.


--------------------
Smovie TV
Pure entertainment.

www.smovie.tv
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j_frost
post Feb 17 2010, 10:41 AM
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Hey mate,

Yeah, I think you may be right. I doubt if it is the tuner itself as I have tried two identical vp3021's and got the same result. I read somewhere that I guy fixed some pixalation issues by disabling "Network Discovery" in windows7. I tried this but no result.

Network Discovery Thread

This may be because my visionplus cards are registered ans sound\video devices rather than a network card as it appears some cable tuners are.

Thanks for the advice I'll keep experimenting.

Thanks

Julian
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j_frost
post Feb 20 2010, 11:21 AM
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Hi guys,

Thought I would post with another advancement.

I reverted back to XP Pro, and all my problems went away again, perfect signal no pixelation. I guess that would eliminate noise induction or signal interference, and prove the antenna point is OK?

I also brought that box inside where the signal is known to be excellent. I ran two machines alongside each other, one stutters, the other doesnt (Off the same antenna point) again confirming it is something with that particular box setup, and not the card or antenna.

To me although unsure what exactly it is, it appears to be something associated with Windows 7 operating system. I would prefer to use the win7 OS over X Ppro as it has media centre with it plus generally better performance overall.

The machine spec is as follows:

Windows7 Enterprise
A8N-Sli-Deluxe (NForce4 chipset)
AMD64 3500+
2Gig DDR ram
NVidia 8800GT
Visionplus 3021 tuner (driver v1.2.3.8)
Soundblaster audigy 2ZS
Thermaltake 480w Power supply
Thermaltake case (Steel)

All drivers have been installed via windows update execpt the tuner drivers.

Thanks again

Julian
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j_frost
post Mar 26 2010, 11:51 AM
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Hi guys,

Finally resolved the issue by purchasing a new card. I went the cheap option for a dual tuner and bought a DTV2000DS. Works perfect.

I think there was an issue with my motherboards NForce4 drivers for windows7 and the card. As previously mentioned, the spectrum drivers and twinhan drivers definately work with win7 x86 and I had also proven the signal and card where ok.

Using dpclat.exe I saw the occasional red flag, but I could not isolate the driver that was the issue.

I now have my spare twinhan card installed in the other win7 machine, so I finally have twin tuners for win7 : )

Thanks again for all the help with this strange problem.

Frosty
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